Timeline for Is Shaolin monk Hu Qiong using "Chi energy" to withstand an electric drill?
Current License: CC BY-SA 3.0
59 events
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| Jul 20, 2023 at 13:36 | comment | added | Evargalo | If the Monk is so confident in the strength Chi energy is confering to his skin, why does he handle the drill himself and doesn't ask the "bio-mechanical engineer", or whichever witness, to do it instead ? | |
| Jul 18, 2023 at 15:57 | answer | added | bukwyrm | timeline score: 2 | |
| Nov 6, 2019 at 6:00 | comment | added | Dapianoman | en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qi#Scientific_view "Chi" is unphysical, in general. Whatever is happening is not being caused by "chi." My conjecture is that the drill is a prop drill or that it is harmless. | |
| Dec 14, 2016 at 17:38 | comment | added | denten | I suggest rewording the question to be about Chi energy in general and not the specific monk / video in particular. | |
| Dec 14, 2015 at 5:31 | comment | added | Daniel F | Can someone with paywall access look at sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0303846707002879 about brain injury from an electric drill? | |
| S Sep 6, 2015 at 3:49 | history | bounty ended | CommunityBot | ||
| S Sep 6, 2015 at 3:49 | history | notice removed | CommunityBot | ||
| S Aug 29, 2015 at 2:42 | history | bounty started | CommunityBot | ||
| S Aug 29, 2015 at 2:42 | history | notice added | user16797 | Authoritative reference needed | |
| Jul 5, 2015 at 18:56 | comment | added | PCARR | I would like to draw specific attention to the sound he makes throughout - an extended and apparently specialized use of kiai which is long and very much concerted with his actions. I would be keen to see him repeat these actions silently. | |
| Nov 10, 2014 at 16:59 | comment | added | Don Kindred | Has any feat remotely like this been attempted under testable, repeatable conditions? I can't imagine that there's never been a good scientist that loved kung-fu. It's just not plausible. Someone must've initiated contact to try it. Maybe someone on the other side? As you'll see here: quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/acu.html under NIH Debacle, proponents of Chi magic go to great lengths to support it. If it is real, wouldn't one of them use the scientific method to support their claims? Whether in it for profit or to enlighten the world, wouldn't they try if it was real? | |
| Jun 12, 2014 at 21:35 | comment | added | Golden Cuy | Possible line of investigation: does medical literature state that drilling is a potential source of injury? | |
| Jun 12, 2014 at 21:01 | comment | added | John Lyon | The drill he used looked to be a hammer drill (based on the model and the noise it made) - a hammer action moves the bit in and out against whatever is being drilled, which could plausibly be to his benefit by removing the bit from direct contact with his skin momentarily. This would allow his skin to un-twist and prevent the bit from biting in and doing any real damage. | |
| Jun 12, 2014 at 4:15 | history | protected | Oddthinking♦ | ||
| Jun 12, 2014 at 4:00 | comment | added | Lost Odinson | Problems with the testing: 1. the sensor measures the pressure against the handle, assuming that he is pushing one directionally against the drill. i.e. hand-> drill-> body. but the system is more complex than that. 2. what were the pressure readings against the wood? 3. what are pressure readings against a human analogue (ballistics gel with artificial bones to support? 4. how much pressure is needed to cause organ damage on a human analogue? Just some problems with the test I observed, but not a definitive rebuttal against the argument for chi. | |
| Jun 10, 2014 at 22:23 | comment | added | user11643 | Okay, I saw the video now. Here's what I got. Whether using Chi or not, that is what would happen. @Articuno the burns and cuts are what we should expect. Skin and tissue are significantly different than wood, specifically, in pliability. Wood is fibrous and rigid, but soft enough to push through it as fibers are torn from it. Skin and tissue is soft like wood, but it is extremely elastic; the skin simply stretches over the drill bit as it turns and only very small pieces are torn away each time, compared to wood. | |
| Jun 10, 2014 at 21:59 | comment | added | user11643 | I went the extra mile and put it against the top of my head on a fairly firm part. Same feeling as the thumb, but it did pull at my hair quite a bit, further supporting my theory. I haven't seen the video, but I would be the guy has some cut, firm abs. I cannot explain the throat, however. The drill quickly grabbed the loose skin around my Adam's apple (yeah, I was stupid enough for that too). For science! | |
| Jun 10, 2014 at 21:59 | comment | added | user11643 | @Oddthinking Having a drill handy, I did the same thing just now on my thumb. Very little discomfort on either direction and I was able to push rather firmly. Put it against my belly and it hurt immediately and slightly cut me. Then I was stupid enough to try the reverse direction. Same thing. My theory: my thumb has little for the drill bit to grab, but my belly has a good deal. While against my belly, the bit readily grabbed the skin around it and began to tear away at it, as it is designed to do. | |
| Jun 10, 2014 at 18:32 | comment | added | user20689 | 1 - The method to measure the force is invalid! He measured the force of the monk'ś hand grip around the drill That force is irrelevant because it's a static force. It's not the force of pressure of the drill against his body. The drill's tip (that's not so sharp) just touch softly the monk's skin! | |
| Apr 6, 2014 at 1:59 | comment | added | user5582 | What should a drill do to human skin? | |
| Apr 5, 2014 at 15:18 | history | rollback | Oddthinking♦ |
Rollback to Revision 9; Post Made Community Wiki
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| S Apr 5, 2014 at 15:16 | history | suggested | Richard | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
Added a vid
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| Apr 5, 2014 at 13:13 | review | Suggested edits | |||
| S Apr 5, 2014 at 15:16 | |||||
| Apr 5, 2014 at 6:38 | comment | added | Question Overflow | Watch the HD version here. It shows on 6:04 and 6:56 that his skin is being twisted by drill rotating in the correct clockwise direction. On 8:15, his supporting hand doesn't show signs of muscles tensioning to counteract his exerting hand. Anyway, a typical drill comes with two handles. The only flaw could be the method of force measurement. But we cannot fault him for that. | |
| S Apr 5, 2014 at 2:40 | history | suggested | Garrett Fogerlie | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
Gave numerical order to the expected answers to help facilitate an answer.
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| Apr 5, 2014 at 0:46 | review | Suggested edits | |||
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| Apr 1, 2014 at 21:13 | comment | added | YungHummmma | A possible answer: From the little bit I watched, they put the pressure transducer on the handle of the drill. This would report pressure if he was drilling into himself, but it would also report pressure if he just squeezed the handle itself very hard. In fact, if you look at the type of drill they're using, it's the type with a second handle for bracing. So he could just be bracing against the drill itself and basically apply as much force as his body will allow, but push the bit a little bit into his skin. | |
| Mar 31, 2014 at 8:56 | comment | added | MMM | @Oddthinking: I've added a fifth possible answer, based on your little experiment. | |
| Mar 31, 2014 at 8:46 | history | edited | MMM | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
Adding 5th possible answer
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| Mar 31, 2014 at 8:44 | comment | added | MMM | @rob: That's now what I was saying. It seemed that the interpretation of Chi in the context of this question was shifting towards "experience and training" which is invalid, given the things the monk was saying. I have clarified what kind of answers I am expecting and as you can see I have the pragmatic approach you've mentioned. | |
| Mar 31, 2014 at 2:44 | comment | added | rjzii | @MMM He's saying that he's using "Chi Energy" but let's be pragmatic, the question is more if he can do the feat or not. Whether or not "chi energy" is involved or not is secondary since if he's performing the feat through other means (i.e. slight of hand) then the explanation is moot. If he is performing the feat then that doesn't mean that his explanation or understanding of how he is doing it is valid. | |
| Mar 31, 2014 at 2:33 | comment | added | user5582 | @Oddthinking Burns and some bleeding is exactly what Hu Qiong experiences when he does this, so that's relevant that your experience seemed similar. How much Chi did that take? | |
| Mar 31, 2014 at 0:18 | comment | added | Oddthinking♦ | Anecdote: I was coincidentally using a cordless drill yesterday, and felt stupid enough to give a careful test. Wood drill bit (the sharpest kind?), fairly large diameter, pushed lightly against my thumb (firmly enough to dent in the skin), at a low speed (probably a small fraction of full speed but still fast enough to look good), both directions (I felt more comfortable when it was in reverse): zero damage to skin, but got hot rather rapidly. I was more worried about burns if I continued the experiment than cuts. Note: I am a professional moderator. Don't try this at home just because I did. | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 20:09 | comment | added | user5582 | @Sklivvz Mental focus and attention are physical processes, comprising activity of neurons in the brain, all of which is measurable. | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 20:03 | comment | added | Sklivvz | @Articuno for example mental focus or attention can be transferred to the right part of the body? | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 19:56 | comment | added | user5582 | @Sklivvz Example? (Also, I clarified my wording.) | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 19:56 | comment | added | Sklivvz | @Articuno "Something not physical or measurable can't be transferred or used". This is false. | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 19:54 | comment | added | user5582 | @Sklivvz Then, the claim that chi has been "transferred... to the right part of the body" or "used" is false by definition. Something neither physical nor measurable can't be transferred through space or used to interact with the physical world. If it's not physical, it can't occupy a position in space. How do you suggest that be incorporated into an answer? | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 19:36 | comment | added | MMM | @rob He is clearly saying that he is transferring Chi to the right part of the body, so he's not talking about "training and experience" | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 19:13 | comment | added | Sklivvz | @Articuno Chi is not a physical, measurable entity: it's life force/mana: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qi. It's a philosophical model, just like ego/superego/id are models in Freudian psychology. Nobody would expect to measure the "ego" values of someone's mind... | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 16:55 | comment | added | rjzii | @Articuno Yup! :) | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 16:54 | comment | added | user5582 | @rob Then, could this question be rephrased as "Is Hu Qiong doing something to withstand an electric drill?" without losing meaning? | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 16:52 | comment | added | rjzii | @Articuno In some cases, that's pretty much what it boils down to. If you study aikido they use the concept of "chi" a lot to mean biomechanics, momentum, balance, and a whole list of other concepts. | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 16:49 | comment | added | user5582 | @rob So, Chi means "training and experience"? | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 16:44 | comment | added | rjzii | @Articuno "Chi energy" is also used as a catch all of a lot of things when it comes to martial arts and older practices that can also be interpreted as "We have no idea why this works, but if you practice this for long long enough you can perform a given feat." In short, "chi energy" is the explanation given because it is the best explanation that they have. | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 15:22 | comment | added | user5582 | @Sklivvz It's not irrelevant if the claim is "he is using Chi energy to do X". If that is the claim, then either falsifying existence of Chi energy or falsifying the claim that X occurred would both falsify the full claim. | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 13:26 | comment | added | Sklivvz | What chi energy is, is irrelevant. Either this guy can perform the feat or not. | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 13:06 | history | edited | MMM | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
grammar
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| Mar 30, 2014 at 13:02 | comment | added | MMM | I have added possible answers for clarification. @Articuno: "Chi energy" is not explained in the show and is open to interpretation. | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 12:58 | history | edited | MMM | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
Added possible answers for clarification
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| Mar 30, 2014 at 12:43 | history | edited | Sklivvz | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
deleted 201 characters in body
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| Mar 30, 2014 at 10:59 | history | tweeted | twitter.com/#!/StackSkeptic/status/450225856179617793 | ||
| Mar 30, 2014 at 2:37 | history | edited | user5582 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
qualified claim
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| Mar 30, 2014 at 2:37 | comment | added | user5582 | Do they say what "Chi energy" is? | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 1:57 | comment | added | Oddthinking♦ | My first assumption is that the drill machine was spinning the bit in the reverse direction, so it tends to push away rather than grab the skin. I'm not convinced that is enough to explain the phenomena though. | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 1:55 | history | edited | Oddthinking♦ | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
Linked to existing questions.
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| Mar 30, 2014 at 1:13 | comment | added | user5582 | @MMM I believe that the show and the professor claim to have confirmed that the monk indeed was pushing the drill against the skull. I don't believe that the test actually confirmed this though. | |
| Mar 30, 2014 at 0:31 | history | edited | Oddthinking♦ | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
Inserted name of engineer. Focussed snippet of video. Removed Skeptics.SE cliches.
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| Mar 29, 2014 at 22:47 | history | asked | MMM | CC BY-SA 3.0 |