Some people believe that FEMA has secret concentration camps as part of a wider strategy to impose martial law. This is an example of a site promoting such a view and Infowars has an article claiming the same.

An example of a specific claim:

I never thought the day would come where I would write about such a horrible subject but the fact is our government, under a program called REX 84 (Readiness Exercise 84) runs over 800 detention camps nationwide. They are all fully operational and ready to receive prisoners should the US government institute martial law.

Is this supported by any factual study?

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I note Wikipedia defines the acronym as "Readiness Exercise 1984" This conspiracy has outlasted 4 US presidents. – Oddthinking Feb 2 at 23:44
The acronym is defined in the quoted passage in the question... – Sonny Ordell Feb 3 at 0:20
@Sonny, yes. I first interpretted "Readiness Exercise 84" as "the 84th Readiness Exercise". Then I read the Wikipedia page, and realised we are talking about 1984 - a 28-year-old conspiracy theory, which rather diminishes the reliability of its predictions, given they haven't come true in a quarter-of-a-century. It's like still claiming that Barak Obama is going to reveal himself as a Muslim and impose Sharia law now that he is President... any day now. – Oddthinking Feb 3 at 0:59
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@Oddthinking he has to wait until the concentration camps are fully in place. – Sonny Ordell Feb 3 at 1:02
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3 Answers

up vote 8 down vote accepted

No, there is no evidence to support this ridiculous claim

There is more evidence of a conspiracy to make people think that the claim is true then there is evidence of the claim.

The pictures and videos that claimants rely on are for the most part deliberate lies. Train repair centers, North Korean labor camps and National Guard training centers are just some of the centers claimed as FEMA concentration camps.

There have been no studies done to debunk this claim and it is unlikely there will be, simply because of how ridiculous it is. Perhaps the next best thing is a detailed debunking from a reliable source.

James Meigs, editor-in-chief of Popular Mechanics appeared on Glenn Beck’s Fox News program to debunk this claim. Transcripts are here and here.

Selected excerpts:

BECK: OK. There is no sound? How come I'm hearing the sound here, Frank. OK. This is something where they're showing a so-called concentration camp. These are turnstiles. This is in a secure area, behind the fence. I don't know how they got this video when it was behind the fence, but they went in and got this video.

You recognized this or you searched for it, right? And what did you find?

MEIGS: Well, it is not very hard to find, like many of these things. The truth is actually fairly evident. This is an Amtrak repair facility in Beach Grove, Indiana. The woman who made this video initially claimed that it's some kind of American Auschwitz. And they have outfitted buildings with gas and they've got these strange turnstiles.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (voice-over): In yet another fenced area, we see a large warehouse building at the end with the electronic turnstiles in front of it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BECK: OK. That they were putting gas heaters of some sort in there.

MEIGS: Right. And what we found out is — first of all, one of those buildings has been knocked down. The other ones were upgraded. Their heating system was obsolete. And more than 15 years ago, they upgraded them to gas heat so they could work on the trains.


MEIGS: Well, there is one detail that the conspiracy theorists leave out. Those are satellite images of a concentration camp in North Korea.


There is a more thorough debunking on the Popular Mechanics web page.

Of course all of that is meaningless since James Meigs is clearly a government shill. :-)

Even ignoring:

  • The evidence used by people making the claim is demonstrably false,
  • Not all of the ~800 alleged camps have been debunked,
  • If this were happening it would be covered up,
  • The difficulty of orchestrating something of this magnitude and keeping it secret,

no decent motive has been proposed and arguably there is a lack of means.

This claim should be given less credibility than reports of leprechauns until a reason exists to consider it seriously.

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you forgot one: if this were true wouldn't all the conspiracy theorists be instantly "disappeared" and put in those very camps to prevent them from getting "the truth" out? :) – jwenting Feb 3 at 7:17
-1 - Glenn Beck is clearly a government shill – DVK Feb 4 at 16:50
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The RFP at the Infowars link you provide states:

....lead times will be short...due to the nature of emergency responses....Personnel onsite...will depend on the size and scope of the recovery effort, but for estimating purposes the camp will range in size from 301 to 2001 persons for up to 30 days in length.

"Emergency responses," "recovery effort," and duration all support the thesis that such camps are intended for emergency support after a disaster and are not intended to be concentration camps.

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and the wording indicates that the camps don't exist (except maybe during exercises), and are far from permanent. – jwenting Feb 3 at 12:40
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The general answer is that the U.S. government and its various agencies have indeed formulated several theoretical plans, as directed by higher-ups in response to the threat of major uprisings or other events, that would result in martial law and in the formation of centers that many would term "concentration camps". REX 84 is only one example. The ADEX list (of roughly 100,000 persons identified as "subversives" who were to be found and detained immediately in the event of the declaration of a nationwide state of emergency) and subsequent FBI databases (including computerized ones in known existence at this very moment) exist to catalogue and track people, both foreign and domestic, who would undoubtedly become "persons of interest" in a state of national emergency. The United States has already proven it can and will do this to sections of its population; specifically, Japanese-Americans detained en masse without cause or trial during WWII.

REX 84 specifies that the Constitution would be "suspended" upon the declaration of a "state of national domestic emergency" by the President. Martial law would be imposed, with members of the military taking over state and local government offices, and the rights and privileges contained within the Constitution would be unavailable.

Such a situation is unconstitutional in several ways; First and foremost, the Constitution of the Unites States of America is the supreme law of the land. It has no provision for suspending itself in its entirety, for any reason. The Framers weren't idiots; such a clause is ripe for abuse and would render the entire document worthless. The Constitution grants powers to the Federal government while reserving rights of the States and the People. Nobody in the Federal Government, not even the President or Congress, can supersede the Constitution or any of its provisions, except as those specific provisions may allow in specific situations. "Suspending" the Constitution in its entirety would be synonymous with repealing the Constitution, as any attempt to do so would be the end of the United States as we know it.

Next, FEMA is a bureaucratic arm of the Executive branch, in no way connected to the military. The power to command the Armed Forces rests several levels higher in the Executive branch with the President, and he may not delegate that power except as specifically prescribed by law; REX 84 is not law, and FEMA, in any case, cannot give orders to the military; it can only "coordinate" with military leadership, and their direction may be superceded by anyone higher in the chain than the officer commanding the troops in that area. As FEMA is currently under the Department of Homeland Security, which is 18th in line of succession to the Presidency, it is extremely unlikely that anyone who directly oversees FEMA would also have direct authority over the military.

Third, the Posse Comitatus Act requires that any military action taken to enforce "law and order" within the United States (basically using the Army as police) requires an act of Congress, just like a declaration of war does. The War Powers Resolution allows the President to send troops anywhere, for any reason, but only for up to 60 days unless further authorized by Congress with specific resolution approving the action, or a declaration of war.

Further, the Constitution doesn't only apply to the federal government. Ex parte Milligan states that while the suspension of habeas corpus (again requiring Congressional action) is legal and constitutional, the use of military tribunals to prosecute civilians of and in a State which affirms the Constitution and in which civilian courts can still function is illegal. Therefore, martial law (that is, the control of all areas of local government by the military) is illegal wherever state and local offices can function on their own (oh, and they haven't disavowed the Constitution and tried to secede). That's why Gitmo had to be created in the first place, and why attempts to move detainees to facilities within the U.S. failed or were aborted.

So, in order for REX 84 to become a long-term reality with any hint of legality, there can't be much left of law and order in the U.S.; the President must declare a state of national domestic emergency, Congress must OK the use of the military beyond 60 days, and must also specifically OK the suspension of habeas corpus. The President can then direct troops as he pleases, with standing orders to obey FEMA's direction. However, soldiers take an oath to obey the Constitution of the United States first, the President second, and their commanding officers third. In order of succession, if any of those say that what FEMA has said to do is wrong, the soldier MUST not do it.

THAT BEING SAID...

Yes, it is possible for the U.S. Government to start rounding up its citizens en masse. They don't need a state of emergency; they can do it now, without suspending the Constitution. The President has standing authority from Congress to detain any individual suspected of terrorism or of aiding and abetting terrorism, and to hold them in detention without trial or bail indefinitely. Congress can revoke this power, if it chooses, but if the President doesn't want to give it up, Congress must be able to override his veto (the last time that happened on something of this nature was the creation of the War Powers Resolution in the first place).

As long as the President has this authority, the FBI, which can commandeer local law enforcement for aid in responding to any terrorist threat within U.S. borders, can come to your home, take you from your spouse and children (who may also be detained), throw you in jail, and let you rot. All it takes is an executive order labelling you, or any group you claim membership of, as a terrorist, and there are several red flags which would apply to a large plurality of U.S. citizens:

  • Owning a firearm
  • Having more than one week's worth of food in storage (Sam's Club/Costco shoppers take note)
  • Owning camping gear sufficient to survive for an extended period without electricity or running water
  • Having said anything disparaging about the United States or its government in public (and the Internet is public)
  • Having donated any money to a charity identified as being in support of a terrorist organization (If your church has ever donated money to any of these organizations, the entire national church congregation, including you, can be accused of aiding terrorism even if you personally never earmarked a penny of your offering)
  • Having ever made a suspicious visit to a country in the Middle East (including Israel and Saudi Arabia; Christians visit Israel regularly as religious pilgrims, as do Jews, and it is one of the Pillars of the Muslim faith to undergo a pilgrimage to Mecca in Saudi Arabia)
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Welcome to Skeptics! Please provide some references to support your claims. You make a large number of claims here that are completely unsupported by evidence, and a large number of speculations that are out of place on Skeptics.SE. – Oddthinking Feb 3 at 1:02
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